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You *gotta* think that eventually all this meta will result in fic.
Have decided my continued obsession during the show's break is due to watching Old Who. Really really really. Because a lot ends up relating to or triggering thoughts. And then these thoughts always end with, "...and that's why the Doctor needs Rose back." MWAH.
I still say you don't need to watch a single episode prior to the 2005 series to enjoy it, but sometimes these old episodes are giving me a more complete picture of who the Doctor was and is. And other times, there're simply giant clams.
Of all things that surprised me the most in watching the classic series, it's the Doctor's relationship with the Time Lords. Coming in as a brand new viewer, my first exposure to the Time Lords was the Doctor mourning their loss and attempting to deal with this huge pain. So it was more than interesting to discover in the classic series that he constantly wavers between simple annoyance to outright loathing of the Time Lords. He hates being on Gallifrey and he hates having to deal with the Time Lords. They really are/were "dusty old senators" who had a tendency to fall into corruption. But they *were* a very real power and a higher authority the Doctor could always turn to. If he got into a mess, he could call on them to fix it, which he did at least once. The one time I saw, it ended up badly for him and his Companions, but it was something that needed to and could be done.
Now I don't want to diminish the fact that this whole planet and race were destroyed. And they *were* his people. He fought on the front lines with them and he was involved in wiping everyone out, which is HUGE. Enormous, even. And that loss/guilt will always be with him in some way, including that whole "last of his kind."
But in S2 you see this loneliness emerging, which at first I thought was missing the Time Lords. But after watching more old Who, I'm coming to think that it's not that he's missing his best pals or even people he can relate to. He and the Time Lords were *never* able to relate to each other. They barely ever interacted. He could probably count on his hand the number of Time Lords he'd miss on a personal level.
I think in S2 the raw pain is over, and it's really starting to sink in for him that he's alone in his god-like state. (Hence the 20,526 "god" references.) He has all this power, and no one else to turn to if he screws up. Like he said in "New Earth," "I'm the Doctor. And if you don't like it... if you want to take it to a higher authority, then there isn't one. It stops with me." There's now this huge burden of needing to be *always* right. Plus the fact that he really doesn't have all the knowledge of the Time Lords, like how to hop between universes. So he's sort of muddling through - sticking to what he knows best, but it's all without a support net.
I once had a conversation with someone about how the Doctor could both be with Rose *and* be lonely (as seen in places like Tooth and Claw.) And this is pretty much it. He's alone in a way that's not so much emotional (Companions have always filled that hole. Not the Time Lords.) but instead is about who he is in relation to the universe. It's the burden of power. And *no one* will be able to take away this kind of loneliness. Even if the odd Time Lord happens to pop up down the road, there's never going to be this higher authority above the Doctor again unless Gallifrey would appear and that power base would return.
And this is why Rose was/is so important to him. Well, one of the reasons. No, she couldn't help him by taking some of that burden of power, but she really became his anchor. Not in a millstone-around-his-neck way, but in a way that showed the Lonely God that he did have a hand to hold as he crossed the universe as this god. I'm stealing![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
wiliqueen's words, because they're just so apt. He needs someone to smile at him and take his hand and trust him, and remind him that he's someone and something infinitely better than the Oncoming Storm... To say it another way so I can throw in the L word, he needs to be loved and accepted for who he is, not just for what he can offer or what he represents. Someone with whom he can turn off being a god, even for just a little while. He also needs to have a purpose/motivation other than "savior," like having someone *he* loves who makes him want to make the universe a better place. That S2 DVD insert by Julie Gardner is also apt. Rose is the Doctor's reason to fight, to endure, to ensure there's light in the darkness.
And that's why he needs to get Rose back.
I still say you don't need to watch a single episode prior to the 2005 series to enjoy it, but sometimes these old episodes are giving me a more complete picture of who the Doctor was and is. And other times, there're simply giant clams.
Of all things that surprised me the most in watching the classic series, it's the Doctor's relationship with the Time Lords. Coming in as a brand new viewer, my first exposure to the Time Lords was the Doctor mourning their loss and attempting to deal with this huge pain. So it was more than interesting to discover in the classic series that he constantly wavers between simple annoyance to outright loathing of the Time Lords. He hates being on Gallifrey and he hates having to deal with the Time Lords. They really are/were "dusty old senators" who had a tendency to fall into corruption. But they *were* a very real power and a higher authority the Doctor could always turn to. If he got into a mess, he could call on them to fix it, which he did at least once. The one time I saw, it ended up badly for him and his Companions, but it was something that needed to and could be done.
Now I don't want to diminish the fact that this whole planet and race were destroyed. And they *were* his people. He fought on the front lines with them and he was involved in wiping everyone out, which is HUGE. Enormous, even. And that loss/guilt will always be with him in some way, including that whole "last of his kind."
But in S2 you see this loneliness emerging, which at first I thought was missing the Time Lords. But after watching more old Who, I'm coming to think that it's not that he's missing his best pals or even people he can relate to. He and the Time Lords were *never* able to relate to each other. They barely ever interacted. He could probably count on his hand the number of Time Lords he'd miss on a personal level.
I think in S2 the raw pain is over, and it's really starting to sink in for him that he's alone in his god-like state. (Hence the 20,526 "god" references.) He has all this power, and no one else to turn to if he screws up. Like he said in "New Earth," "I'm the Doctor. And if you don't like it... if you want to take it to a higher authority, then there isn't one. It stops with me." There's now this huge burden of needing to be *always* right. Plus the fact that he really doesn't have all the knowledge of the Time Lords, like how to hop between universes. So he's sort of muddling through - sticking to what he knows best, but it's all without a support net.
I once had a conversation with someone about how the Doctor could both be with Rose *and* be lonely (as seen in places like Tooth and Claw.) And this is pretty much it. He's alone in a way that's not so much emotional (Companions have always filled that hole. Not the Time Lords.) but instead is about who he is in relation to the universe. It's the burden of power. And *no one* will be able to take away this kind of loneliness. Even if the odd Time Lord happens to pop up down the road, there's never going to be this higher authority above the Doctor again unless Gallifrey would appear and that power base would return.
And this is why Rose was/is so important to him. Well, one of the reasons. No, she couldn't help him by taking some of that burden of power, but she really became his anchor. Not in a millstone-around-his-neck way, but in a way that showed the Lonely God that he did have a hand to hold as he crossed the universe as this god. I'm stealing
wiliqueen's words, because they're just so apt. He needs someone to smile at him and take his hand and trust him, and remind him that he's someone and something infinitely better than the Oncoming Storm... To say it another way so I can throw in the L word, he needs to be loved and accepted for who he is, not just for what he can offer or what he represents. Someone with whom he can turn off being a god, even for just a little while. He also needs to have a purpose/motivation other than "savior," like having someone *he* loves who makes him want to make the universe a better place. That S2 DVD insert by Julie Gardner is also apt. Rose is the Doctor's reason to fight, to endure, to ensure there's light in the darkness.And that's why he needs to get Rose back.
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That sounds dirty.
And I think I need to quote your subject line.
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It *was* rather dirty... ;)
And I think I need to quote your subject line.
HA! :D
You know, if you take all my babble over the past year and add it up, it'd probably equate to about 5 novels by now. If only I could switch from meta mode to fic mode.
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But can't say I've seen anything yet where I'd say that the 2005+ series is totally off-base with the classic stuff. Different, yes, but I can easily follow the canon from the old to the new.
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Half the time I’m wondering how *this* picked up such a militant following.
I think this might be part of it.
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Heh heh.
But there was already a war on when I got here, and I’d already picked a side without realizing it, and the original series started looking like the path to the Dark Side. :-)
Oh, tell me about it. Somehow those lines got drawn. For a while the Classic stuff was looking to me to be the Sacred Text of those that hated what I loved. Why on Earth would I want to watch that? Screw it. But curiosity won out, and also the urge to find the reason why what I liked was so very wrong. Haven't found that reason yet. Odd, that.
I think this might be part of it.
Yeah, I guess for a lot of people it is very strongly tied to their childhood. I find it pretty hard to identify with since I don't have anything comparable from my childhood. I mean, I really don't care a lick about, say, the Dukes of Hazard or Nancy Drew, other than to have a vague nostalgia about them.
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Yes, exactly! But the pull of the Dark Side is strong—I’ve wanted to meet Susan ever since I read Five Moments In a Life That Never Was, and if Ace is half as cool as she sounds…
But curiosity won out, and also the urge to find the reason why what I liked was so very wrong. Haven’t found that reason yet. Odd, that.
I can feel my resistance crumbling. I’m so weak. :-)
Yeah, I guess for a lot of people it is very strongly tied to their childhood. I find it pretty hard to identify with since I don’t have anything comparable from my childhood.
Well, there were people writing Pevensie incest fic after The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe movie came out. That bothered me. So I do sympathize, to a degree. I just wish we could call a truce. Agree to disagree. (And that the Rose-bashers would stay out of Rose-centric communities.)
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Aww, Susan. Susan screams a lot. :D (One thing bad about those earliest shows/incarnations - not a whole lot of character depth. Although the Doctor leaving her behind was actually touching.)
and if Ace is half as cool as she sounds…
Ace is really a whole lot of fun!
I just wish we could call a truce. Agree to disagree.
You wonder why that can't happen. Come on! If everyone just sang kumbaya!
(And that the Rose-bashers would stay out of Rose-centric communities.)
YES. Yeesh. That right there has been my greatest source of boggling in this fandom. It's like some are on a mission from God to constantly try and smack down the character, the actress and any fans of the character and/or actress. I don't get it. Character hate - sure. Everyone has them at times. But to actively seek out people and communities to air that hate towards time and again?
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For me it is very much tied to my childhood. I started watching back in the early 80s, near the end of Tom Baker's time, and it was my very first scifi show ever, so it holds a very special place in my heart. And I think I could safely say it led to my first shipping experience, although I certainly wasn't involed in fandom then! ;)
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