mrv3000 | More Waters of Mars

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doctor who,
new who

More Waters of Mars

I really don't think I have any more joy for this show. It's funny - I actually had more love for the SJA episode with Ten than I'm feeling right now. Once upon a time there was this quirky fun time travel show I fell in love with. And then they bait-and-switched me!

Thing is, I completely understand why the Doctor is where he is. (Except for that whole thing about being scared of death. I don't quite get that.) But the Doctor's "I AM GOD" attitude? I see why he's there at this point. RTD's done a fantastic job of leading him down this path full of ups and downs. It's not out of nowhere.

But still. Even though there were hints of this throughout - even since the beginning of 2005 - it's still not really the show I started watching. Or why I started watching and kept watching. I'm kind of glad the end is coming since I'm ready for it to be over.

For the longest time I felt slightly guilty about enjoying stuff in the altverse (fic, socks) to the point of not really caring what happened on the real show. But man, after this episode I'm not feeling guilty anymore. I'm happy Rose and TenII are off in another universe and don't have to deal with all this shit. May the walls of the universes never come down again.

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Does this man you're giving up on it?

Myself, I'm surious to what the show will become after DT and RTD leave. Will it go back to be a fun-loving romp.

I, for one, hope so...

I'll watch through the end of this year, but then... I don't know. I'm sort of feeling like I'll move on. I might watch the first episode though, just to see what the new Doctor is like.

I know, I'm feeling like that too.
I feel I've spent so much energy worrying about what's gonna happen, part of me wants it to end so I can go on and ignore it ever happened and setttle for happier fics.

It's not like the show has declined on quality but it has gotten so depressing and I kinda hate that.

it's like RTD Reeled us in with his happy-go-lucky show and then settled to torture us for a few years

Yeah, and I'm just kind of burned out on Doctor Who because of it. The show, that is. You'll have to pry Rose and Ten II out of my cold, dead hands. :D

and yeah that's ANOTHER THING...okay RTD you arse, you brought us ON to this happy happy joy joy ride, reeled us all in and then said okay i'm out, time for doom and gloom, even though you all dont know i'm leaving, i'll bring you on this ride some more, ooh here have some more rose, oh wait i'm taking her away again, lets give you alittle more happy ten, oh wait, now he's gone nuts and think's he's a god, lets have him destroy himself and....i'm out."
yep, that's RTD

I can see the picture he's painting, and it makes sense, but I'm not enjoying it anymore.

By the end of the last series I was guarded. Now I'm sort of like the Doctor in Manhattan.. Kill me! Just kill me. Do IT! It's not fun any more. :(

Yeah. I want off this ride.

I have a very stressful and often sad career. I'm not entertained or 'relieved' from that when I'm beaten over the head with suffering and angst.

Maybe if I my day to day life wasn't full of people who are suffering I'd be more tolerant... but as it is, if i want to see people hurting and falling apart and into madness, well, I'll just go to work.

Yeah, I hear you. And I don't even have a job like yours.

I don't need saccharin lollipops and rainbows all the time, but I don't need this.

I know what you mean, even if I plan to continue watching. It's completely understandable, where Ten is, but it isn't the fun romp anymore. SJA has more of the essence of the Doctor Who I know than this does, and right now, I need the lighthearted children's adventures far more, I guess. I think all the recent companions would be heartbroken and furious if they saw him like this (and I almost wish, for his sake, that maybe one of them could.)

God. This whole year of this show has been one long kick in the stomach, really.

I really wish one of them could see him like this as well. They'd alternate slapping him and hugging him. Maybe at the same time. And all would be well.

Sarah Jane and Donna tag-teaming it. They could be really stern. (Also they would get along, I think. Maybe. I was watching the Third Doctor serial "Invasion of the Dinosaurs" the other day and both Sarah Jane and Donna know the value of a paper trail, and where to find it. I like this variety of practicality, and not just because I worked in medical records for five years.)

I think they'd get along great too! As long as SJ doesn't go hugging any cute guys. XD

Yep. That's why we have Rose & Ten 2. Because in Pete's world, they're back at where they were in series 2: happy and joyous and fun and... so much in love. :D
That's the show in fell in love too. Because it felt different from american scifi shows, so dark and "serious"... now Doctor who is just like them soooo.... I really don't know...

Yeah, I'm really not looking for another BSG.

yep you got it, that's what doctor who has ALWAYS had, a lot more happy, sure there was/is drama-y bits and such but it's getting sooooo dark and twisted and BSG (or sg u if anyone's watching that) i can already see how s5 is gonna be...
grrr

oh i'm SO in agreement with you, glad to see someone else feels the same. Dont get me wrong i love david and i love doctor who etc but after tonight i was like "is that it?" they totally built it up saying it was better than midnight (which i liked MUCH better cuz donna was there too lol) he definately is losing it, changing time, thinking he really is a god and "a winner" not a survivor. Having no one there to keep him in check has really affected him, i think it's been that way since the stolen earth, and then losing everyone and leaving rose behind then on to the specials and now this with ood sigma at the end, but wtf is with that? i mean i've seen stuf so i have an idea, but i'm really disappointed with RTD and i guess maybe this is me realising that it has changed and it is good that david is going on to do bigger stuf, he is a smart man i think he already realised things also.
I'm happy rose/ten 2 are not around too, i just hope none of what happens affects them :(
and dragging this stuf out over the course of a YEAR with really hardly any shows (maybe one or two more in between friggin EASTER and now would have been nice lol) and now another month...it's worn me out lol.
i'll probably check out s5 but i dont see myself staying around :( ( i still love you david ! lol)

You know, I'm really glad the shows have been spaced out. Could you imagine if all this depressing angst had been right in a row?

This is why I thought this episode was great.

I'm kind of ready to see the story completed, too. And the way RTD is taking it is leading it to a place where I can let go.

I've never really expected to like series 5 (I'm just not fond of Moffat) so I'm glad that it looks like RTD will take the Doctor to a point where I think his story is at a finishing point.

Sure, I'll probably give series 5 a try, but I know it won't be the same for me.

Yeah, it's definitely leading me to a place where I can easily let go, that's for sure. :D

I get why the Doctor is dark but her, I got the feeling that it was competition between RTD and Moffat, now. Moffat is known to write dark/scary episodes and that it's RTD's way of telling him, with WoM and the End of Times specials "nah nah nah, I win, you can't do better!".

So is this what Doctor Who is going to become, the show, I mean? Not a family show where the viewers would be entertained but a show a frightening show with sometimes lost in the middle a funny episode?

And it doesn't bode well for the doctor/companion a la Doctor/Donna, in the future. Yes, the doctor needs someone to stop him, but it's losing his companions, one by one, (companions he had grown to love more than he did before) which made him snap. He wasn't even that dark after the Time War and before meeting Rose. He could have turned that way, mind you, but he didn't.

So without companions, he has the potential to go insane, but having companions that he loves and loses has him going insane. It's a no win situation. Unless he goes back to having companions that are just... there but that he doesn't allow in his heart because HE KNOWS that when he loses them, he'll lose his sanity.

I'm not sure what it'll mean for the future. They could well ignore everything that happens here. No idea.

I get what you're saying. I personally don't mind the dark stuff, but it really is very far removed from the show I fell in love with. I totally loved WoM and am looking forward to the finale, but I sort of have big hopes that the new series will be lighter again.

I know most don't really trust Moffat, and I will desperatly miss RTD in some ways, but maybe it will mean that the show can be more like it used to be in the fun and happy way.

So maybe you should at least give the 2010 show a chance to make you love it again. It's what I'm hoping for :)

I'm at the point now where I don't really even care about trying to recapture the fun show I fell in love with. :-\

I don't think I've ever seen a show behave quite like this before.

I mean, there are dark, depressing shows, but they generally start off dark and stay that way. (BSG.) And so you know to not let yourself get too invested.

Then there are shows that have a dark arc, where awful things happen (Buffy), but by the end, there's hope again.

Then we have Doctor Who and Torchwood. They started reasonably happily, had moments of joy, and the good guys always won. Then it changed. They got darker, more horrible, and all the joy was sucked from it.

What happened to my happy place?

Seriously, every time I see there's a new DW special I have more of a feeling of dread rather than anticipation. I think about how much I've cried over previous events, in particular, "Doomsday" and the end of Season 4. And I don't know if I can go through that again.

Yes. The joy was sucked from it! While I understand the internal logic of the path the Doctor's gone down, I'm not quite sure why we're down it.

That's exactly it. It's like scary/dark shows are the rage, it's what makes a show "brilliant, exceptional, unique" or whatever you want to call it and that now, it's the course to make DW darker and darker. And with Moffat, now? Yep, there will be scary/dark episodes, and the lighter ones will be about the Doctor flirting with the babe of the episode. Oh joy.

The alt!verse with TenII and Rose is more and more appealing every day.

I'm not against dark shows. I watch some even though lately, I prefer sitcoms because RL is bad enough. But I fear that DW is going the dark way too oftenly, now and that it won't change with Moffat. He knows that dark episodes get higher ratings and critic approval, it's not in his interest to come back to light/fun episodes.

Completely agreed. It's not that I don't understand or even like the way the show has gone, I definitely still get it and enjoy it...but in a completely different way It's been heading this way for a while, and before that things were in place that it could but now that we're here...I'm ready to get out.

It's a brilliant story still but seriously how could any kid watch that kind of story? It's one thing to do it on a show that's supposed to be dark, but like you said, they bait and switched us here. Fall in love with the time traveling and romantic times of season 1&2, keep you on with the hope of happy endings in season 3&4 and then finally at last, come to a point where I'm not sure I'd watch to watch 11 anyway because the Doctor deserves (for good and bad) for this to end and I'd kind of rather act like he did.

(uses happy kitty icon from days of at least moderate hope, and kitties)

I wonder what kids thought of it. And what parents with kids thought of it. Did they get "mummy, why is the Doctor evil?" questions?

I wonder, too, what the kids thought. It's like Superman turning into a dark character 9 times out of 10. Maybe the adults love that but the children... I doubt it.

Personally, I was glad that there was a limit to the Doctor's regenerations. I have watched enough Highlander episodes to know that immortality or very long lives are a curse. I didn't like that Jack was turned into an immortal because it's killing Jack's soul, in my opinion. And Highlander explored immortality enough, in depth, to be convinced of that.

So Jack immortal? That's an horrible fate for him. And for the Doctor, I was glad that he only had a few regenerations left because it meant that he would finally found peace, after almost 1 000 years. Now I fear that greed from the producers and the BBC will turn the doctor into a new kind of immortal, or that he will have another set of 13 lives offered to him somehow and therefore will mean that he'll have another 1 000 years to see people he loves dying.

I really don't wish that fate on characters I love.

You know, I'm pretty sure somewhere on the DW website they specifically call into question the 13 lives limit, saying it might not apply anymore. So he might have that fate. :-\

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